The Seismic Shift Markets Are Missing | Practical Lessons from Ben Hunt & Grant Williams

In this episode, we dive deep into some of the most thought-provoking ideas from two of the most original minds in investing: Ben Hunt and Grant Williams. Through a curated selection of powerful clips, we explore how markets have transformed from mechanisms of capital allocation to platforms of narrative and speculation. Ben and Grant challenge conventional wisdom, question the stories we tell ourselves about investing, and propose frameworks for navigating a radically different market landscape going forward. Whether it's the evolution of CEO incentives, the lifecycle of narratives, or why staying rich is harder than getting rich, this episode is packed with timeless insights. Topics Covered: Why what worked for 40 years may not work anymore The market as a political utility and what that really means The disconnection between stock prices and real businesses How narratives shape market behavior and prices The language of growth vs. value in investing The CEO’s evolving role as a storyteller Using the narrative lifecycle as an investment framework Speculation vs. investing and how to tell the difference How Ben Hunt applies the minimax regret framework to life decisions Timestamps: 00:00 – Introduction: “You Got Rich. Now Stay Rich.” 01:19 – Ben & Grant’s narrative depth and why they matter 02:39 – Investing in a post-Trump world 03:56 – The era of rising rates and the end of old playbooks 06:00 – From zero-day options to long-term necessity 08:01 – The value of resilience and durable businesses 11:01 – The market as a political utility 14:52 – Ben Hunt’s three real investments 19:40 – Why the business is no longer the business 21:00 – The “Day of Theater” and CEO storytelling 26:39 – Growth language vs. value language 32:39 – Investing as a communication framework 36:00 – The rise of speculation and meme markets 43:07 – Narrative lifecycle: Ben Hunt on how stories drive markets 49:00 – Price follows narrative — not fundamentals 55:10 – Narrative investing vs. fundamental investing 57:14 – Mini-Max Regret and decisions under uncertainty